Skip to content
New issue

Have a question about this project? Sign up for a free GitHub account to open an issue and contact its maintainers and the community.

By clicking “Sign up for GitHub”, you agree to our terms of service and privacy statement. We’ll occasionally send you account related emails.

Already on GitHub? Sign in to your account

Apply mag_jam_mult to helical and drum magazines #75970

Merged
merged 1 commit into from
Aug 29, 2024

Conversation

GuardianDll
Copy link
Member

@GuardianDll GuardianDll commented Aug 26, 2024

Summary

None

Purpose of change

#74696 added field, that supposed to make drum and helical mags handle damage worse than default. This pr applies it

Describe the solution

Apply field, document how field should be used

Additional context

Chances are following:
image
image

@github-actions github-actions bot added <Documentation> Design documents, internal info, guides and help. [JSON] Changes (can be) made in JSON Mods Issues related to mods or modding Items: Magazines Ammo holding items and objects. [Markdown] Markdown issues and PRs Items: Ammo / Guns Ammunition for all kinds of weapons and these weapons themselves Mods: Aftershock Anything to do with the Aftershock mod Mods: Xedra Evolved Anything to do with Xedra Evolved labels Aug 26, 2024
@github-actions github-actions bot added json-styled JSON lint passed, label assigned by github actions astyled astyled PR, label is assigned by github actions BasicBuildPassed This PR builds correctly, label assigned by github actions labels Aug 26, 2024
@Hyperseeker
Copy link
Contributor

For future reference: assuming we ever get quad-stack magazines and the like (or, say, someone eventually adds one of those as a mod), what should the multiplier be for those? Are they supposed to be as unreliable as drum magazines?

@GuardianDll
Copy link
Member Author

i dunno, even this numbers are pretty asspull imo, both because there is little to no data, and because our damaging system is not very detailed (damage can be only one of five state duh)

@Holli-Git
Copy link
Contributor

For future reference: assuming we ever get quad-stack magazines and the like (or, say, someone eventually adds one of those as a mod), what should the multiplier be for those? Are they supposed to be as unreliable as drum magazines?

We do have quadstacks, and I think some tri stacks

@Hyperseeker
Copy link
Contributor

If we do have those, then maybe it's worth considering what multiplier they ought to have, as well. Maybe in a follow-up PR?

@GuardianDll
Copy link
Member Author

can be here also, but i am really far from knowing how they should behave, so i'd rely on you
(also how to find said mags? searching by quadstacks did not yield anything)

@Hyperseeker
Copy link
Contributor

I don't actually have a good source for magazine reliability aside from those in the other PR; the issue of reliability has not come up until now. Conventional wisdom (which often gets repeated by third parties) suggests that anything more-complicated than a double-stack (which is what your conventional 30-round STANAG magazine is) is not reliable enough for the benefits of higher capacity. I am, however, yet to see actual studies that third parties keep referring to. (Not that I've searched very hard so far.)

I'll see if I can come up with anything. I suspect there won't be a lot, or at least not a lot available online. Ideally, I'd want something like the reliability study by the Army that I'd linked to in the previous PR.

(also how to find said mags? searching by quadstacks did not yield anything)

You have to know how a given magazine works. For example, the 60- and 100-round STANAG box magazines that we have are both quad-stack, which you can tell visually by the fact that they're much wider than your 30-rounder. (These are not the same magazines, by the way, but you can get the idea from the comparison.)

It's called a quad-stack because they stack the rounds inside into four columns, at least eventually, hence the width requirements. (They narrow down to single-stack at the feeding lips.)

For what it's worth, while Magpul was unable to produce a reliable quad-stack – at least reliable to their own high standard – the German manufacturer Schmeisser sells a polymer 60-rounder, which is apparently reliable enough:

When it came to reliability, we fired a mix of 500 rounds through the two mags [Gen I and Gen II of the same model — H.] with just a couple of warning flags to raise. First off, when using brass-cased ammo, we had no problems. The warning lights just went off with imported lacquered 5.56 (looking at you, Wolf), which sometimes delivered a failure to feed towards the end of the mag.

Granted, 500 rounds is barely scientific, but it's something.

@SirPendrak
Copy link
Contributor

For future reference: assuming we ever get quad-stack magazines and the like (or, say, someone eventually adds one of those as a mod), what should the multiplier be for those? Are they supposed to be as unreliable as drum magazines?

We do have quadstacks, and I think some tri stacks

Exodi 60mag is 4-row, same for HUB-01 EXOTIC HWP 60 mag

@Holli-Git
Copy link
Contributor

Holli-Git commented Aug 27, 2024

Exodi 60mag is 4-row, same for HUB-01 EXOTIC HWP 60 mag

Only the HWP is a quad stack, Exodii's 60 rounder's a pan

@Holli-Git
Copy link
Contributor

It's called a quad-stack because they stack the rounds inside into four columns, at least eventually, hence the width requirements. (They narrow down to single-stack at the feeding lips.)

I'm being pedantic here. Magazines being single feed or double feed is dependent on the firearm. Quadstacks could narrow into single or double feed. I think quadstacks have a harder time becoming single feed just because of the friction but I don't think it's impossible

@Maleclypse Maleclypse merged commit 97460ba into CleverRaven:master Aug 29, 2024
21 of 27 checks passed
@GuardianDll GuardianDll deleted the mags_do_jam branch August 29, 2024 06:20
@Hyperseeker
Copy link
Contributor

As a follow-up to this, now that it's merged: is it possible to assign a decimal to the multiplier value? That would solve whatever conundra I might have for complex magazines I add myself (even though it will be a while before that happens).

@GuardianDll
Copy link
Member Author

yes, it's a double under the hood, can do entire 1.23456789

Sign up for free to join this conversation on GitHub. Already have an account? Sign in to comment
Labels
astyled astyled PR, label is assigned by github actions BasicBuildPassed This PR builds correctly, label assigned by github actions <Documentation> Design documents, internal info, guides and help. Items: Ammo / Guns Ammunition for all kinds of weapons and these weapons themselves Items: Magazines Ammo holding items and objects. [JSON] Changes (can be) made in JSON json-styled JSON lint passed, label assigned by github actions [Markdown] Markdown issues and PRs Mods: Aftershock Anything to do with the Aftershock mod Mods: Xedra Evolved Anything to do with Xedra Evolved Mods Issues related to mods or modding
Projects
None yet
Development

Successfully merging this pull request may close these issues.

5 participants